The political representative of Kalinowski's regiment and the "Resistance" movement, Zmytser Shchigelski, visited Vilnius.

He talked about current political events with the Svoboda correspondent.

Watch the full version of the interview on Radio Svaboda's YouTube channel.

"Holding actions in Belarus today is a suicidal practice"

— If we compare with 2020, are we closer to victory or further?

- I think it's closer.

People's mentality and perception of the situation have changed a lot.

In 2020, this was a naive perception.

They say, 200,000 will come out - and everything will be resolved, the security forces will go over to the side of the people.

But 2020 made it clear that this is not the case.

Force is needed to overthrow this regime.

- What kind of power is this?

- Including Kalinovsky's regiment, and the "Commonwealth Movement", and banners, and people who are inside Belarus.

Without decisive actions, it is impossible to overthrow the dictator's regime.

- Tell us about the unification of Kalinowski's regiment and "Cyberpartisans".

What is it, what to expect?

- We never say what to expect.

Because the news is what has already happened, not what will happen someday.

There is a structure - Kalinowski's regiment (boys and girls who fight), they have people, they strive for results.

And these results are visible.

It's the same with "Kiberov" - there is a structure, there are people, there are results.

This association is logical.

Kalinowski's regiment and "Cyber ​​guerrillas" have been working since the first one was created.

Vadim Kabanchuk, deputy commander of Kalinovsky's regiment, is one of the founders of "Resistance".

- "Resistance" still exists?

- Relatively.

A significant number of people, especially from the "Storks are flying" structure, went to Kalinowski's regiment.

Today, conducting actions similar to those carried out by "Busly" is a suicidal practice that will not lead to anything.

We will lose people, frame them, and there will be no result.

There are people left in Belarus who provide some information in order to better understand the situation inside the country and not to lose connections.

- Do you still think that the fate of Belarus is being decided in Ukraine today?

— The fate of Belarus is decided in Belarus and by Belarusians.

But the prerequisites for this are created by the Ukrainians, as well as, among others, Kalinovsky's regiment and "Kybera".

"It's nonsense about the super-fast Ukrainians"

- Tell us what happened at the session in Romania, where the Ukrainians gathered the Belarusian opposition.

I know that you were among the participants of that session that is overgrown...

— ...conspiracy theories.

There was nothing special.

This is an opportunity to simulate the situation, to develop a strategy.

All these are gossips - reviews of the Belarusian opposition, about the super-slanderous Ukrainians who are puppeteers of the Belarusian opposition.

This is all delusion.

- Were some Ukrainian authorities behind this?

- There were no special services, no counterintelligence, but the money for the organization was Ukrainian.

- The money of pro-Russian oligarchs can be Ukrainian.

- This was not the money of pro-Russian oligarchs.

They brought together representatives of very different groups, which is positive.

Although somehow they started talking.

This is an opportunity for us to understand what is happening, what are the options.

And for Ukrainians, it is important to understand the situation in Belarus, because this is lacking, both among people and among experts.

By contrast, Belarusians also have a poor understanding of the situation in Ukraine.

"The empire will be weak if it loses the war"

- Mr. Zmytser, you were recently in Bakhmut.

What did you see there?

- I saw the war.

You can watch many videos from Bahmut.

That's how it actually looks.

There are destroyed buildings, shelling, 5-7 explosions per minute.

The most important thing is not the landscape, but the people who are there;

we came to the fighters of the Kalinowski regiment.

Of course, the conditions are very difficult, it's cold, the basement, the positions, but the people are heroic.

This is a significant part of the national elite, they are ready to sacrifice their lives.

They are doing this to return Belarus to Belarusians.

- But no one understands how to liberate Belarus.

- We can now come up with a hundred reasons why this is impossible.

And we can look for opportunities.

This is much more fruitful than thinking that they will disarm, but nothing will be achieved.

There may be problems, but we need to be ready for the window of opportunity that we had in 1918, in 1991.

This is possible only when the empire is weak.

And I am sure that the empire will be weak if it loses the war, and we will have these opportunities again.

"We can be ready for a revolutionary situation"

- Do you now have a plan for the liberation of Belarus?

- We have a strategy for the liberation of Belarus.

What is a plan?

When we enter from one point, move to another, such plans can be written, and there will be any number of them.

But it is not serious.

Seriously, it's a strategy.

The liberation of Belarus is possible primarily by those Belarusians who are inside the country.

In fact, this is a revolution, for which a revolutionary situation is needed, as it was in 2020.

There must be an entity that will be able to take advantage of this situation and get the regime to leave.

It can be the Polish way with a round table, and the Romanian one.

Maybe something in between.

- How can a revolutionary situation develop in the country, when the regime covers everything in concrete, the possessors leave the country?

- "Stolypin ties" in 1907 also seemed to be rolled into concrete and pushed abroad, but then it was 1917.

We cannot create a revolutionary situation, but we can be ready for it.

In 2020, this was not enough.

Now Belarusian society is more mature, there is no political infantilism.

- A popular joke in social networks - if changes are achieved with the help of Kalinovsky's stick, then a junta will be established.

This can be?

- A transitional period is necessary, it will require someone who will create the conditions for new elections.

Today, we actually have no mass media in the country.

How are you going to hold elections if there is no media, no court?

Reform of the judicial system is needed.

We do not have political parties that are driven under concrete.

There are no election commissions - those that exist now must be disbanded.

While all this will be created, it is necessary that the sewage works, there is electricity, public transport runs, people can go to clinics, children can go to school.

You can call it a junta or a revolutionary government, but there must be such an object.

It's not about the name, but about what he will do.

It will take at least six months to hold new elections, and maybe more.

"We will organize elections in thirty days" is utter populism.

There are statistics of transit modes,

so the junta is far from the worst option.

The probability that the transit will be successful and the country will pass from tyranny to democracy is the highest under the junta.

- Will there be no peace in Belarus?

- No one wants blood and war.

It would be ideal if the regime, Lukashenka or someone after him went to the negotiations and there was a "round table".

But in order for such negotiations to take place, a force is needed that will force negotiations.

If the next time in Belarus happens in 2020, as far as I understand from conversations with people from Belarus, people will come out with weapons, "Molotov cocktails" to solve the issue once and for all.

Secure communication


with our editors.

HERE